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Author Topic: The Punisher '80s & '90s
Bionic Bigfoot
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I know we have discussed these movies before (I remember CT & I talking about it a long time ago.) I just watched these movies again. I got to meet Tom Jane (The Punisher from the new movie) at a convention last weekend. I got his autograph on an 8X10 photo and on a Punisher Movie poster.
Anyways...what did y'all think about these two movies?
I liked them both. But what CT & I discussed before...the '80s version didn't follow the Punisher comics much at all except for the title and the character's name. We even said that it could have been titled something else and just been some other action movie. He didn't even have the trademark Punisher skull on his chest. I did however like that movie. I liked Dolph Lungren as the Punisher. That movie was a little darker than the new one. I liked the Japanees Yakuza storyline in that movie. My favorite Punisher Graphic Novel from the '80s was Assassin's Guild, which dealt with the Yakuza. My favorite scene in the old movie was when the Punisher drops through that skylight and lands on the table in the casino and starts shooting the place up with a machine gun.
I liked the new Punisher movie too. It followed the comics a lot closer and he had the skull on his chest and everything. It had a larger budget and you could tell. They threw in some comic relief (the 2 neighbor guys) to lighten it up some.
I liked both movies and plan on going to see a sequel if they make one. But I prefer the Punisher comics. They are a lot darker. My favorite storylines were from the '80s comics when he teamed up with a computer and weapons developer called Microchip and he rode around in the black "Battle Van." That was cool.

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Brode
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I can't stand the 80s Punisher movie. They took a character with demons and an actual personality and turned him into another John Matrix clone. I do like the remake, though.

As for whether or not the remake was lighter, I can't really say, because I saw a hunting knife go through a guy's jaw and come out his mouth.

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CrashesParties n TheValley
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What's Up B. Bigfoot!!........This Topic Is "The Bomb" [Big Grin]

I Just Recently, Decided To Start To Collect The PunisheR Comic Book(sort of a new hobby)And Any & Everything That Has To Do With The PunisheR I'm trying to become a "Hardcore" PunisheR fan. I've found a Comic Book Store,that sell used Comic Books,and they have BOXES!!! of old PunisheR Comics for...75cents!!!! I bought The PunisheR "War Zone"(It even had the Blowtorch and Popcicle scene just like the movie) [Smile] I also got The PunisheR "Eurohit" The Final Conflict No. 7 Of 7. And The PunisheR "War Journal". How cool is that....You met Tom Jane(aka) The PunisheR I know i have a lot to learn....But i know The PunisheR is my fav. out of all the Marvel Dudes. And i'm looking for anything that has to do with The PunisheR .......Action Figures,Posters,Tee-Shirts,etc.


P.S. Hope They Are'nt Any Hard Feeling About The Scarface & Rapper's Thing. You And I have always been COOL With One Another [Cool] And Besides....Who Else Is Going To "School" On The PuinsheR I Think I Can Learn A Lot From You B.Bigfoot. Take It Easy Bro!!!!!

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Guido The Killer Pimp
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This is a great review on the 80's version

Released: 1989

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Erich is all growed up...


Tagline:
Judge. Jury. Executioner. All in a day's work.

Entire Story in Fewer Words than are in this Sentence:
Vigilante cop kills Mafia, then Yakuza, then more Mafia.

Homoeroticism:
This move was sufficiently queer, but could have been gayer. One scene takes place in a bar that has bouncers who are wearing leather gear for some reason. I was waiting for them to break into “Turbo Lover.” the Punisher’s former buddy and partner, Louis Gossett Jr., visits him in prison, after he’s nabbed by the cops. Gossett grabs the Punisher and shakes him vigorously for nearly a full minute; repeatedly shouting “let me in!” The highlight of gayness, however, is clearly Dolph’s sessions of prayer and meditation during which he sits in front of candles and asks Jesus if he should kill more bad guys. Oh yeah, he’s naked and oiled up like a bowling ball during all of these sessions.

Corpse Count:
A very impressive 93! Plus the Punisher beats, maims and tortures plenty of bad guys without necessarily killing them. The carnage hits its apex when Dolph and a partner walk into a room full of meditating ninjas and mow them down with Uzis. Freeze frame revealed that 17 were killed in about 6 seconds. Possibly an 80s Action record.

Novelty Death:
This is my favorite part of the Punisher, but isn’t it always true of any film? At this moment the movie took on a surreal quality. I thought I was watching a Bunuel flick. The mafia bosses have agreed to meet the Yakuza bosses in an Italian restaurant. When the Yakuza arrive, everyone in the restaurant, including old ladies, waiters, busboys--not a single person who looks like a hit man—all stand up and pull out pistols. Then they blow away the boss’ body guards. Then the bosses die from their poisoned drinks. For some reason, the Yakuza chick finds it necessary to point out to the dying mobsters that it isn’t the wine that’s poisoned, but the glasses! As if this is somehow more sinister. Then a different Yakuza chick takes off her earrings that also function as throwing stars and she uses them to crucify the Mafiosi who didn’t’ drink his wine.

Pre-Mortem One Liner:
the Punisher has turned the tables on a Japanese torture doctor strapping him into his own hydraulic rack. Before asking the doctor for information he says, “I don’t want to stretch this out.” After receiving the information, the Punisher leaves the room, then comes back into the room and turns the rack on.

Post Mortem One Liner:
Back to the jailhouse with Louis Gossett. After begging the Punisher to “let him in,” Gossett confronts the Punisher about his rampage asking, “What do you call 125 murders in five years?” the Punisher’s stoic reply, “A work in progress.”

Was there a Stupid Chief?
Sort of. Gossett filled that role to a degree, serving as an advocate for law and order rather than vigilante justice. But since the Punisher was operating totally on his own, Gossett had no badge and gun taking, or demoting power.

Stupid Political Content:
The liberal justice system keeps letting the mobsters out, necessitating the Punisher. Nothing new. There’s also an interesting thing going on with attitudes toward the Japanese. We admire them because they have throwing stars and cool costumes, but hate them because they’re taking over our country and usurping our position of economic dominance (this is 80s Action, remember). The Yakuza move in to displace the New York mob, just as they were buying up golf courses and theme parks in California. They’re efficient, ruthless and dedicated. Luckily, they’re also pretty small, so Dolph has an easy time killing them.

How Bad is it Really?
Pretty bad. I read a couple of other reviews and fan-boys were really ****ed off because the film deviates from the comic book. For example, the Punisher doesn’t wear that stupid ****ing t-shirt with a skull on it. Not being a 35-year-old virgin, I’m indifferent to such matters. But the movie was rather poorly made. For example, Gossett and his new partner go hunting for the Punisher in the sewers. The partner says something like, “our odds of finding him are one in a million, but we might get lucky.” Then the two embark on their search. A few minutes later and no Punisher. That’s it. The search is never mentioned again.

What You Learned:
Nothing. I sat here for five minutes trying to think of something, but the whole movie is just a guy in black shooting people and occasionally getting naked
http://www.ruthlessreviews.com/80saction/80saction.html

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All for Noms and Noms for all...
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And here's the review for Punisher 2004 from the same website...

Tagline:
"The Punishment Begins April 16, 2004." And doesn't stop for two ****ing hours, if ever.

Entire Story in Fewer Words than are in this Sentence:
Revenge is a dish best served gay.

Homoeroticism:
I could write a book on Tom Jane's chest alone--a gay book. So why not start with the best? The chest is most prominently featured in The Punisher's (a.k.a. Frank Castle) mini "training" montage, complete with oiled pecs, phallic weaponry, and at least one full minute of working with tools. We then watch Castle drink heartily (sans shirt) in front of a massive fan. But I was most puzzled at the 36-minute mark when, for no reason, the camera held on Castle's hairy chest long enough for a viewer to count the beads of sweat. Moving away from Castle's strapping form, it could be argued that since he loved a woman, it was fitting that she meet a violent end. And then there's Howard Saint's (John Travolta) right-hand man, a closet homosexual, who at one point is photographed by Frank kissing another man. Frank also hangs a man upside-down (needless to say, the man's shirt is removed) and proceeds to shut him up by shoving a "popsicle" in his mouth. Even Freud would have cringed at the lack of subtlety. There are also two weirdos who dance with each other while listening to opera; an assassin from Memphis who wears nail polish and sings to his victims; and a burly, blond Russian who is all beef, and just happens to wear the tightest shirt ever released by a wardrobe department. Travolta wraps things up by stabbing a man to death in the most overt sexual metaphor ever seen in an action movie. As Travolta thrusts the "knife" (there are those pesky quotation marks again) into his victim, they embrace, and the pair groan, pant, and clutch. Release, cue cigarette.

Corpse Count:
A solid 45 human beings are sent packing, although a good chuck of the dead are Frank's family (blasted in Puerto Rico by Howard Saint's goons). It would have been 46, but there was some confusion during the opening sequence and I counted Frank as a casualty until I knew that he was undercover and only faking his death to capture a.......Christ, enough already.

How Bad Is It Really?
Retiring-FBI-agent-who-is-brought-back-in story aside, it's not as bad as it could have been. Sound convincing? **** man, it's a mess, and I hold John Travolta responsible. His acting is so bad that I had to wonder if he was actually trying to win next year's Razzie so that people would pay attention to him once again. Hell, even has-been Roy Scheider shows up to embarrass himself (although he is quickly murdered). And I can accept that Frank is a tough guy, but must he really survive being kicked, beaten, thrown from a bridge, and shot in the chest at point blank range? Oh, I almost forgot that he was partially set on fire and blown from the dock after a massive explosion a mere six inches from his face. And I would chuckle at how ridiculous it was to watch Frank smash a glass case without suffering so much as a cut, but I'd be trumped by the fact that Frank also took a bullet in his heart on at least two occasions.

Post-Mortem One-Liner:
As usual, these guys save all their talking for those moments immediately preceding a murder. As one man states, "If you're gonna kill me, could you leave my face alone? For my mother?" Surprisingly, his pussy is spared. Frank's best line occurs as he is leaving Puerto Rico to begin his quest for revenge. A local man says, "Go with God!" Franks replies, "God's gonna sit this one out." Presumably he meant unlike the previous 10,000 years where the Almighty intervened constantly in the affairs of men. As the film ends, there's another great exchange, made that much better by the booming soundtrack:

Frank: You took everything from me.
Howard: You killed my son.
(Wild screaming, massive explosion)
Frank: Both of 'em.
Stupid Political Content:
Very little, as this is 2004, and surely we've moved past divisive politics in our entertainment. Frank does make a manly advocate for violent revenge, however, as he practically repeats George W. Bush's campaign rhetoric verbatim: "If you want peace, prepare for war........Sometimes it is necessary to act outside the law." And we're with you George.

Novelty Death:
Oooh, several worth mentioning, my friends. A man is set on fire by an exploding grill. A mother and child are run over by a truck (although the filmmakers cut away before the little one is squashed). Frank "fires" a knife into the assassin's neck. Frank splits a man's skull with the blade from a paper cutter. Travolta throws his wife off a bridge and into the path of a speeding train (here's hoping he keeps this in mind for Kelly Preston). At least five people are massacred by an exploding champagne bottle. And finally, Travolta himself is dragged behind an automobile, taken to a car lot, and set on fire so that he may continue on (still attached to the car) through a maze of exploding vehicles and Hiroshima-like clouds of smoke and flame. No actor deserved it more.

What You Learned:
Whenever John Travolta is eyeing yet another comeback, stay the **** away from the cineplex.


Noms [Cool]

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Bionic Bigfoot
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That reminds me... in the '80s Punisher, what's up with him sitting butt naked in the middle of the sewer tunnel? That was just plain wierd!
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Bionic Bigfoot
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Hey, CT...I met cover artist, Tim Bradstreet, that draws the covers for all the new Punisher comics. He autographed all the covers in my collection! If you like the Punisher, read some of the new ones from MAX comics. It has a parental advisory Explicit Content warning on the cover because it is extremely violent and has very strong language too. The stories are very good in them. Pretty gritty stuff.
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Guido The Killer Pimp
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NOMS, that review is great i did not see that one on ruthless...

Bionic Bigfoot -i actually have 2 cgc graded copies of Amazing Spider-Man #129 at 9.0

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Bionic Bigfoot
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That's cool, Guido. Bet they are worth a good bit.
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